Anti-monarchists: what system then?

On another blog I read a thread discussing royalty and nearly everybody who expressed an opinion about the subject was vehement that they hated the very idea of a monarchy and disliked the Windsors intensely.

Yet on other dissident right blogs there are a lot of people who are now disenchanted with ”democracy” or a republican form of government.

I fall into that category. Equality is not within the realm of possibility. No two people are equal, or the same, not even identical twins.  And all around I see that ”democracy” has been corrupted everywhere into a kind of rule by the worst, and the most self-interested.

Thomas Jefferson did not intend to foster the idea that all men (and yes, women) are equal. The fact that his words are misunderstood and purposely twisted in many cases has enabled a lot of people to tell themselves that actual equality exists, that we are born equal, or that complete equality could exist if we try to force it, as is happening now.

So for those who loathe the idea of monarchy of any kind, what then is the best system, in such a case? And why is monarchy to be shunned and condemned as so many Americans (and others too) think? I’m curious as to how people think about this.

16 thoughts on “Anti-monarchists: what system then?

  1. America could have had a Anglo-Saxon Puritan Theocracy.

    The old colonies had very honorable, dignified and caring clergy. The cream of the colonial crop. They were not appreciated and then America was culturally hollowed out. Methodism, Baptistism, Mormonism, Catholicism and now atheism,Islam. Money came to be more important than heritage. People are so capricious.

    I do think Theoretically aristocracy and monarchy can be good systems. however in our Anglo herigtage our aristocracy was destroyed and replaced. The Normanesque catholic aristocracy was never keen on the Puritan Values I hold dear.

    History shows that an bourgeois Theocracy is Puritanisms best hope. The “non conformist conscience” was important.

    Nice day

    Liked by 1 person

    1. Puritan, thank you for your thoughtful response as well. I agree with you about the Puritan clergy from what I do know of them, and of their character. Are there any men of that calibre around now? There could be, unbeknownst to us. It’s easy to be pessimistic about the hope of any kind of restoration. You are right that our old aristocracy is now non-exxistent for all intents and purposes. If if were possible to raise up a new crop of inspiring leaders, including the clergy.
      Again thanks for your responses. I appreciate them.

      Liked by 1 person

  2. Taking a middle-way on this question that might be more useful. Try exploring older Republicanism. Highly doubt modern technocratic bureaucracies and their parallel– mass manipulation/democracy– inevitably and naturally evolve from a Republican form of government. We might have the wrong suspect. First, Republican government likely has a range of elitism. Rather than explicit monarchism, we might be more interested (as Americans) in restoring a local elitism that has ties to populace. Also, English monarchism is not the same as the absolutist Continental variety. Both Americans and English have a constitutional framework, so there’s quite a bit of overlap. After all, where did we get our Bill of Rights or the idea of Republican government itself? As originally had in the colonies, the governors and state governments, even House of Burgesess, fit almost in a modular way under Royal Authority. Why not restore these more ‘modular parts’, imitating the older colonial forms of government (which there indeed was a diversity)? In Virginia, I believe it was Governor, House of B., Wardens and Judges that mainly held commonweal powers. Anyway, I think there are models that can be taken from Old Federalism or Republicanism, and plenty to draw from our peculiar past. Recall, the Federalists were the first to make overture to England after the Revolution in light of French Jacobinism, concerning themselves with anti-Revolutionary alliances. See how Old Federalism translated through time– from Washington and Adam’s Federalist Party, to the Whig Party. to perhaps the Constitutional Unionists which then split back into Democratic and Republican parties upon the eve of the civil war. But the tendency did not disappear. I would pay less attention to the national theatrics, and rather set eyes upon Governorships, and if less ambitious, likely the county officials.

    Finally, the more practical question regarding ‘how to’? Don’t discount Mormonism which became a systematic organization of filibustering. Theodemocracy is simply becoming the majority on a local level. This could be done in a portion of a city, a single town, perhaps a county. The backbone of it wasn’t necessarily larger families but projecting economic cooperatives and storehouses. The Mormons in Nauvoo Illinois created a council of 50, and using the Masonic lodges (fraternal orders), not only controlled the county and local mayoralship of where they settled but were slowly gaining state power. So, the the key is using similar institutions, namely, church and fraternity together, combined with an economic program of mutual aid. The latter is especially neglected, and I think is closer to the mark of our problems (capitalism vs. socialism) than a more figurative concern respecting political systems. Again, the latter is not a big deal, as local fits into national or pan-national– county judge or state governor under ‘xyz’.

    Lastly, upon the succession crisis after Jospeh Smith’s Jr. death, there were various pathways Mormon groups attempted. Most involved a form of charismatic or prophetic monarchism. If there was any consensus it was a hope placed on Joseph Smith III’s eventually maturity which even Bringham Young pined upon (until the entire Smith family went with the Reorganization). If we can’t wait for the English Royals, why not ready ourselves for a charismatic leadership? An older example than Mormonism might be like the charismatic claims of Richard Brothers, Prince of the Hebrews and line of Judah. But I suspect many Mormon practices were ecclectic, deriving not only from Restorationist baptists, presbyterians, and methodism but also the radical underground and folk religion from England.

    The biggest obstacle, imo, is the cultural depletion of younger people. Much can be had by American and Protestant history, but sadly our generation is mostly poisoned– even on the Altright– against this deposit. So, they refuse to withdraw from it in any kind of substantial way. Therefore, they’ll never have the capacity for restoration or revival of any sort. So, when an actual crisis emerges, the shots will be called by someone else and you’ll see very fast cooption.

    Liked by 2 people

    1. Charles, thanks so much for your very thorough replies on this subject. Lots of food for thought there. My question was framed hastily on the basis of a discussion I had just read, and mostly the comments had an odor of Jacobinism about them; I suppose that prompted me to recoil from those sentiments. I thought of course of the regicides by the Jacobins and also in England with Charles I and then of course of the Bolsheviks and the Romanovs. But thanks for providing something to think about and explore further.

      Liked by 1 person

    2. Charles

      If you are going to make comments this grand then I think you should be writing important books on the subjects. TV interviews even. Mormonism seems to be a strong interest of yours. They are a tad to keen on foreign immigration.
      The loss of federalist national structure was a tragedy, and what did America gain from it. “Log Cabin Presidents” hostile to established East Coasters? If only The USA had established an Anglo Puritanical National Church firmly establishing the national identity. It would have been so much better than America for all Europe’s undesirables then all the worlds undesirables.

      Bonnyblue

      Thanks
      We NEED a crop of competent clergy for the challenges ahead. A rejection of the nonsense. Identify with our heritage.

      Like

    3. Hi Puritan, Actually my interest is counterposing more Protestant alternatives to the Mormon church, and lately been reading about dissenting movements from Mormonism, aka. the Utah Bringhamite church. Mormonism drew my interest for a number of reasons, including this blog. Bonnyblue a while back indicated most historic Anglo- New England old stock moved west, with migration, and today is greatly represented in Far West states like Utah. So, for English folk, Mormonism is a pressing question that needs constructive answers. I’m not pro-Mormon, yet I don’t see Mormonism homogeneous and some mormon movement churches are surprisingly closer to Protestantism than others. If you live in the Far West (especially in ‘greater Utah states’), then Mormonism likely looms larger than elsewhere. No one denies the Mormons have succeeded in keleping large families and strong church communities, almost like a ‘nation in a nation’. One reason for this is their connection with historical fillibustering in the West, and the consequent nigh institution of it in LDS. However, this isn’t solely their heritage as Methodists did the same in the settlement of the Willamette valley OR, even Santa Clara valley in CA (little Wilamette). Of course, TX is the prime example, and as you indicated the Lone Star movement even had its Committees of Correspondence. All this needs more study and imitation, and keep in mind Mormons have only preserved a wider heritage which did not come from themselves but the general environment of the 1830’s and 1840’s. I can’t imagine an American Puritan national church that rejects the impact of revivalism, but methodists came very close to making a national church that combined both Puritan (holiness) aspects with revival, itinerancy, lay agency, and an episcopal system.

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    4. Thanks Charles

      This post had me a confused

      I am not sure who you think I am. Do you think I am http://www.puritans.net/ ? That is NOT me.
      His website is a good one however my opinions are somewhat different.

      Yes the young generation is so poisoned, maybe the Amish are conservative whites only hope?
      Make the kids get back to the fields, I think I might have some Luddite heritage.

      How do you feel about generic “white advocates” like Vdare and Amren. Watching them act like Anglo heritage isn’t special is disappointing to me, they feel so hollow?

      Liked by 1 person

  3. Another notion is the pro-monarchists are fantastical. Total waste of time. BIWF is generous on the question by dividing traditions between Manasseh and Ephraim. The former is ‘great’. The latter is greater and a commwealth of nations. But they are both kindred, even twins. This was never a trouble for me. But for the neo-monarchists who have no genuine Protestant identity, they are at a loss and make tragic divisions.

    Liked by 1 person

  4. Monarchists really dredge up a bunch of non-issues and irrelevant. Why is legal union necessary (between the States and Crown)? What would it really accomplish? How about first restoring cultural unity? But how can that be done without answering the religious question? Most Altright run from religious questions, and are as bad as liberals in so far as leaving it to ahistorical, acontextual, individualist mindset. Others are just plain revisionists or new fangled. Who ever heard of Roman Catholic America unless you’re Spanish or Mexican? The Jacobin monarchists, who are anti-hanoveran (of course not knowing much of 18th c. English culture by which early American republic was rooted), are simply French catholics. It’s just another rabbit trail and alien to actual British stock.

    Liked by 1 person

  5. Hi Puritan, OK. Yes, I had your identity with Puritans.net confused. My opinion of AmRen and ilk is they are pining for the European Right and promote “pagano-Christianity”, aka. Roman Catholicism, as a middle road between American Christians and nationalist pagans. Why a middle road is needed with an insignificant and ridiculous tendency like paganism is beyond me. This same view is mainstream in the Altright. Yes, Anabaptism needs to be examined, but Amish don’t have a lock on separated Agrarian communities. Historically Anabaptism has found ways into low church Protestantism, especially with congregationalists or early Independents. It truly needs to be better understood in this light.

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  6. Mormons would good about copying utopian elements from Anabaptism, namely, the Shakers in Ohio via Campbellite and Mormon convert, Sidney Rigdon. This is where their “law of consecration” comes from or communitarianism, aka. Order of Enoch.

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  7. the trick is to trace these more modern movements’ geneology backwards to puritanism and the church of England. Then you start to recognize their Anglo-ism and how they belong to a common heritage.

    Liked by 1 person

  8. I agree. Democracy is unworkable and morally bankrupt.
    Imagine for a moment you live in Baltimore. You want safe streets and economic growth, but your neighbors are 70% black, most on gov assistance, and have 1 to 2 relatives in prison or awaiting trial.

    In the voting booth, they will outnumber and out vote you and other whites. They have no interest in safe streets and putting more of their criminal children and relatives in prison. You, your white neighbors, and civilization will lose every election. Which is why Baltimore is the way it is.

    Like

  9. I need to get to the point where I can revive Anglo Puritan structure. I need help to get my health needs sorted. I need to get to a place where I can do my Puritan thing.
    Us ,we leadership will have to come from us who care about our heritage. Our societies have been squandered and exploited by cheap feckless opportunists and the deeply corrupt. It naturally will be us good serious people to put it right. I know I have it in me If I get the chance.

    Where in the world would be suitable? I need some warm people I can trust. People I can Love?

    Help me World

    Puritan Love

    Like

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